PRISONS IN CRISIS

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Expand view Topic review: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Guest » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:05 pm

Cannydc wrote:
Major wrote:IMHO that situation is appropriate for a lot of them.

Charge appropriate embassies for the cost of looking after the countryfolk in OUR prisons.


And they charge us huge sums to keep our drug smuggling, sex predator, paedophile scum in their jails.

And to top up their income, arrest tourists on trumped up charges.

Haven't really thought this through, have you.

As for dire prison conditions being 'appropriate' - we are judged as a country on the way we treat our prisoners and our elderly. How do you think that is going so far ?


Cue tumbleweed

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Cannydc » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:59 am

Major wrote:IMHO that situation is appropriate for a lot of them.

Charge appropriate embassies for the cost of looking after the countryfolk in OUR prisons.


And they charge us huge sums to keep our drug smuggling, sex predator, paedophile scum in their jails.

And to top up their income, arrest tourists on trumped up charges.

Haven't really thought this through, have you.

As for dire prison conditions being 'appropriate' - we are judged as a country on the way we treat our prisoners and our elderly. How do you think that is going so far ?

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Major » Sun Feb 18, 2018 7:29 pm

IMHO that situation is appropriate for a lot of them.

Charge appropriate embassies for the cost of looking after the countryfolk in OUR prisons.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Cannydc » Sun Feb 18, 2018 5:32 am

The scale of the crisis engulfing Britain’s prisons can be revealed, after an Observer investigation found that two-thirds are providing inmates with inadequate conditions or unacceptable treatment.

An analysis of hundreds of inspections covering 118 institutions found that a staggering 68% are now providing unsatisfactory standards in at least one respect, with two in five jails deemed to be unacceptably unsafe.

Rory Stewart, the prisons minister, described the state of some jails as “deeply disturbing”. Writing in the Observer, he concedes that prisons are rife with psychoactive drugs, and see “increasing levels of violence committed by prisoners, and horrifying rates of self-harm”.

Speaking to the Observer, Lord Woolf, the former lord chief justice – who oversaw an inquiry after the notorious Strangeways riot in 1990, in which two people died – warned that there was a real risk of such an outbreak happening again.

“[If] you ask me whether we have gone back to where we were pre-Strangeways, I think we are there in that sort of territory,” said Woolf.


This won't go away. Tory governments always seem to spawn prison riots, and it's usually down to under-investment allowing infrastructure to rot along with inmates. It's going to be a long, hot summer for the Tory home secretary (who is that, by the way ?).

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... rugs-gangs

(It's Amber Rudd, by the way)

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Matt25 » Sun Jan 21, 2018 11:57 pm

Yeah there were a fair few ex Army lads where I was 0 both as prisoners and as screws. Met a lad from training in there.

I enjoyed my 5 years but left when I got a job offer and had a kid. Looking back I wish I had stayed on but that's life.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Cannydc » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:22 pm

Matt25 wrote:
Cannydc wrote:@Matt

I know a bit about Colchester having served 23 years (albeit in the RAF) and one or two mates spent a few weeks there. You certainly knew how to make an immaculate bedpack and lay out kit after that, and you never came out less fit than when you went in.

Your description of the boredom, misery and underlying hopelessness is in complete contrast to the stories of opulent luxury fed to us by a media eager to please a particular audience who are of the opinion that Victorian filth and squalor are the answer to cure all criminal behaviour.

Thanks for sharing it.


An immaculate bed pack for sure. Had plenty of practice with that. Colchester was an experience - hated it at first but it did me some good I think. The good thing was once I got back to my unit it was a fresh start and wasn't held against me like a prison record is. When were you in the RAF?

Just my experience of it. people give out about prisoners having better conditions than they used to but the same applies for life in general. Heard stories about what it was like years ago from some of the older prisoners when they had to slop out and getting a hiding from the screws - people surely dont want to go back to that.

A few of you asked about drinking. I have to be honest I still do but nothing like I used to before this happened. Seeing what I did on CCTV when I was arrested I hated myself for. The most I would have on a night out would be 4 pints and definitely no shots or anything else but beer. I didn't go to a mates stag because I was worried about getting drunk. In prison I got to do some sessions on anger management, alcohol awareness and parenting and had plenty of time to think about how I ended up there. I'm 30 now with a gf (wife to be) and 2 kids and i can't do anything that would take me away from all that again.


Joined 1971, left 1994.

Good to see lessons learned. When all is said and done, a load of ex-services have slipped even further down the alcohol and prison route than you - it seems to be a hazard of the job. Many on here will never understand the way the forces were with alcohol (legendary NAAFI nights, and the messes were even worse) or how hard it could be to readjust to civvy street.

Good for you for working it out.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Matt25 » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:08 pm

Cannydc wrote:@Matt

I know a bit about Colchester having served 23 years (albeit in the RAF) and one or two mates spent a few weeks there. You certainly knew how to make an immaculate bedpack and lay out kit after that, and you never came out less fit than when you went in.

Your description of the boredom, misery and underlying hopelessness is in complete contrast to the stories of opulent luxury fed to us by a media eager to please a particular audience who are of the opinion that Victorian filth and squalor are the answer to cure all criminal behaviour.

Thanks for sharing it.


An immaculate bed pack for sure. Had plenty of practice with that. Colchester was an experience - hated it at first but it did me some good I think. The good thing was once I got back to my unit it was a fresh start and wasn't held against me like a prison record is. When were you in the RAF?

Just my experience of it. people give out about prisoners having better conditions than they used to but the same applies for life in general. Heard stories about what it was like years ago from some of the older prisoners when they had to slop out and getting a hiding from the screws - people surely dont want to go back to that.

A few of you asked about drinking. I have to be honest I still do but nothing like I used to before this happened. Seeing what I did on CCTV when I was arrested I hated myself for. The most I would have on a night out would be 4 pints and definitely no shots or anything else but beer. I didn't go to a mates stag because I was worried about getting drunk. In prison I got to do some sessions on anger management, alcohol awareness and parenting and had plenty of time to think about how I ended up there. I'm 30 now with a gf (wife to be) and 2 kids and i can't do anything that would take me away from all that again.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by jp761 » Sun Jan 21, 2018 3:48 pm

I remember watching one of those documentary police shows. Where on an alcohol fuelled night out this guy punched someone, the guy he punched flopped to the floor hit his head on a curb and later died.

A copper said to guy who threw the punch, you seem like a decent guy you have a good job you have no previous, and now there will be serious consequences for your actions. He also said to a work college some people basically need to leave alcohol alone, he's obviously right. If you know it makes you very aggressive and violent leave it alone, one punch could turn into a manslaughter charge just like what happened to the guy in that episode.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Lady Murasaki » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:35 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:I'm glad you're here with your sense Raggs. But people who know they get aggressive when drinking use the alcohol for courage/power. Not just for having a good time like non aggressive people. By aggressive I mean violent not just argumentative.


Maybe they start off having a good time because they're drunk, but then they overreact to something and get aggressive. However, if they know they might do that, they should lay off the booze or cut down at least.


Yep, that's why I asked Matt the question. Hope he doesn't mind. Alcohol definitely helps bring out the demon for some people, do they have that self awareness?

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Raggamuffin » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:28 am

Lady Murasaki wrote:I'm glad you're here with your sense Raggs. But people who know they get aggressive when drinking use the alcohol for courage/power. Not just for having a good time like non aggressive people. By aggressive I mean violent not just argumentative.


Maybe they start off having a good time because they're drunk, but then they overreact to something and get aggressive. However, if they know they might do that, they should lay off the booze or cut down at least.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Lady Murasaki » Sun Jan 21, 2018 9:14 am

I'm glad you're here with your sense Raggs. But people who know they get aggressive when drinking use the alcohol for courage/power. Not just for having a good time like non aggressive people. By aggressive I mean violent not just argumentative.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Raggamuffin » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:55 am

Lady Murasaki wrote:
Raggamuffin wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:
Matt25 wrote:
Snookerballs wrote:Thanks for telling how it really is.

You appear to be saying that a large proportion of inmates have no hope of any help or coming to terms with a Prison sentence, whilst inside, so what chance have they got when they are released


No problem.

Yes. I am lucky that when I got out I went back home to my family and had somewhere to live. Alot don't. I work for my mate's company so I had my job to go back too and start earning (and paying tax!) again. If you have been in prison it is really hard to get a job and I'd say alot in prison never had a job before - some wouldn't know how to work or want to work and others just don't have any skills. I met lads there that were on their 7th or 8th sentence or worse and just don't seem to be able to hack it in the real world and end up going back. Not sure how you can help them if they don't want to be helped


Do you still drink and get aggressive? Or have you learnt from going inside?


This would be my question too. I very much appreciate Matt giving us his story, and it seems fairly typical these days - got drunk and assaulted someone. The question is - if someone knows that they have a tendency to get aggressive when they're drunk, do they learn not to drink so much?

Prison is supposed to be a deterrent to a large extent - if you don't want to go to prison, don't do anything to warrant it, but there are people who end up back in prison.


Also, if you know that you will get aggressive, as evidenced from past experience, what are the triggers for drinking? Do people like Matt learn about themselves by being inside?
I appreciate him opening up too.


Yes, although there might not be any triggers for drinking other than just wanting to go out and have a good time.

They have to think about the victim as well - being beaten up is pretty horrible and it's something which probably affects someone's life.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Lady Murasaki » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:52 am

Raggamuffin wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:
Matt25 wrote:
Snookerballs wrote:Thanks for telling how it really is.

You appear to be saying that a large proportion of inmates have no hope of any help or coming to terms with a Prison sentence, whilst inside, so what chance have they got when they are released


No problem.

Yes. I am lucky that when I got out I went back home to my family and had somewhere to live. Alot don't. I work for my mate's company so I had my job to go back too and start earning (and paying tax!) again. If you have been in prison it is really hard to get a job and I'd say alot in prison never had a job before - some wouldn't know how to work or want to work and others just don't have any skills. I met lads there that were on their 7th or 8th sentence or worse and just don't seem to be able to hack it in the real world and end up going back. Not sure how you can help them if they don't want to be helped


Do you still drink and get aggressive? Or have you learnt from going inside?


This would be my question too. I very much appreciate Matt giving us his story, and it seems fairly typical these days - got drunk and assaulted someone. The question is - if someone knows that they have a tendency to get aggressive when they're drunk, do they learn not to drink so much?

Prison is supposed to be a deterrent to a large extent - if you don't want to go to prison, don't do anything to warrant it, but there are people who end up back in prison.


Also, if you know that you will get aggressive, as evidenced from past experience, what are the triggers for drinking? Do people like Matt learn about themselves by being inside?
I appreciate him opening up too.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Raggamuffin » Sun Jan 21, 2018 8:28 am

Lady Murasaki wrote:
Matt25 wrote:
Snookerballs wrote:Thanks for telling how it really is.

You appear to be saying that a large proportion of inmates have no hope of any help or coming to terms with a Prison sentence, whilst inside, so what chance have they got when they are released


No problem.

Yes. I am lucky that when I got out I went back home to my family and had somewhere to live. Alot don't. I work for my mate's company so I had my job to go back too and start earning (and paying tax!) again. If you have been in prison it is really hard to get a job and I'd say alot in prison never had a job before - some wouldn't know how to work or want to work and others just don't have any skills. I met lads there that were on their 7th or 8th sentence or worse and just don't seem to be able to hack it in the real world and end up going back. Not sure how you can help them if they don't want to be helped


Do you still drink and get aggressive? Or have you learnt from going inside?


This would be my question too. I very much appreciate Matt giving us his story, and it seems fairly typical these days - got drunk and assaulted someone. The question is - if someone knows that they have a tendency to get aggressive when they're drunk, do they learn not to drink so much?

Prison is supposed to be a deterrent to a large extent - if you don't want to go to prison, don't do anything to warrant it, but there are people who end up back in prison.

Re: PRISONS IN CRISIS

Post by Lady Murasaki » Sun Jan 21, 2018 7:28 am

Matt25 wrote:
Snookerballs wrote:Thanks for telling how it really is.

You appear to be saying that a large proportion of inmates have no hope of any help or coming to terms with a Prison sentence, whilst inside, so what chance have they got when they are released


No problem.

Yes. I am lucky that when I got out I went back home to my family and had somewhere to live. Alot don't. I work for my mate's company so I had my job to go back too and start earning (and paying tax!) again. If you have been in prison it is really hard to get a job and I'd say alot in prison never had a job before - some wouldn't know how to work or want to work and others just don't have any skills. I met lads there that were on their 7th or 8th sentence or worse and just don't seem to be able to hack it in the real world and end up going back. Not sure how you can help them if they don't want to be helped


Do you still drink and get aggressive? Or have you learnt from going inside?

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