At what point should they be arrested?

[Maddog]

Let's take a closer look at the criminal activities of those opposed to the Occupy movement, the much beloved by arseholes Tea Party movement.

As stated earlier these unsavoury characters, the Koch brothers, funded Americans for Prosperity and FreedomWorks which are linked to the Tea Party movement.



Their crimes (of which there are many) dwarf anything by Occupy and include:

DEFECATION: A Koch Industries subsidiary ynegligently dumped hundreds of thousands of gallons of aviation fuel into wetlands near the Mississippi River. They also dumped million gallons of high-ammonia wastewater. Koch Petroleum paid the Dakota County Park System a $6 million fine and $2 million in remediation costs, and was ordered to serve three years of probation.

In 2007, Koch Nitrogen's plant in Enid, Oklahoma, was listed as the third highest company releasing toxic chemicals in Oklahoma.

THEFT: In 1999, a federal jury found that Koch Industries had stolen oil from government and American Indian lands, had lied about its purchases more than 24,000 times, and was fined $553,504.

In 2001, Koch Industries paid $25 million to the federal government to settle a federal lawsuit that found the company had improperly taken more oil than it had paid for from federal and Indian land.

UNLAWFUL KILLING: In 1999, a Texas jury found that negligence had led to the rupture of the Koch pipeline that fueled the explosion killing the two teenagers, and awarded a $296 million verdict — "the largest compensatory damages judgment in a wrongful death case against a corporation in U.S. history"

(Wiki)

Helps to put things into perspective, don't you think?

Not really. If they broke the law and were not punished, then I could see your point.

Are you saying that they did not break the law or that they were punished for breaking the law? If the latter please provide details of the punishments they personally received.

It appears they were held responsible in civil court (not criminal) and their punishments were fines. Civil courts don't put people in jail. Do you know the difference between Civil and Criminal cases?

Jesus buddy, your post lists the punishments, and then you ask me what the fuck they were.

He was making a point lamp. Sadly, it was like an Airbus 380 - 37,000 feet over your head.

The point is that the state never puts some high exec in jail for an employees death. Whichever court.

The state never puts anyone in jail for wrongful death, it's a civil suit. If someone commits the criminal act of murder, they will go to jail if convicted.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

[Stooo]

The state never puts anyone in jail for wrongful death, it's a civil suit. If someone commits the criminal act of murder, they will go to jail if convicted.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

We have a corporate manslaughter charge over here. Negligent directors can do some serious time.

[Maddog]

The state never puts anyone in jail for wrongful death, it's a civil suit. If someone commits the criminal act of murder, they will go to jail if convicted.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

We have a corporate manslaughter charge over here. Negligent directors can do some serious time.

We might too. But that would be a criminal case, not a civil case. My point is unchanged. I have never said that people should be treated differently because of how much money they have. If the Koch brothers commit a criminal act, they should be arrested and tried like anyone else. Ask Bernie Madoff if all that money helps.

[Stooo]

The state never puts anyone in jail for wrongful death, it's a civil suit. If someone commits the criminal act of murder, they will go to jail if convicted.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

We have a corporate manslaughter charge over here. Negligent directors can do some serious time.

We might too. But that would be a criminal case, not a civil case. My point is unchanged. I have never said that people should be treated differently because of how much money they have. If the Koch brothers commit a criminal act, they should be arrested and tried like anyone else. Ask Bernie Madoff if all that money helps.

If they've stolen something then it's a criminal act, surely

[Maddog]

The state never puts anyone in jail for wrongful death, it's a civil suit. If someone commits the criminal act of murder, they will go to jail if convicted.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

We have a corporate manslaughter charge over here. Negligent directors can do some serious time.

We might too. But that would be a criminal case, not a civil case. My point is unchanged. I have never said that people should be treated differently because of how much money they have. If the Koch brothers commit a criminal act, they should be arrested and tried like anyone else. Ask Bernie Madoff if all that money helps.

If they've stolen something then it's a criminal act, surely

Yes, if they stole something it is. Ask Madoff.

They didn't steal something. If you max out your credit cards and can't repay the company, one could say you stole something, but we don't consider that a crime, unless you intended to do so, by committing some sort of fraud. If I steal your credit card and use it, that is a criminal act.

[Stooo]

Yes, if they stole something it is. Ask Madoff.

They didn't steal something. If you max out your credit cards and can't repay the company, one could say you stole something, but we don't consider that a crime, unless you intended to do so, by committing some sort of fraud. If I steal your credit card and use it, that is a criminal act.

Writing a cheque that won't cash because of lack of funds is a criminal act, seems like a better analogy.

[Maddog]

Yes, if they stole something it is. Ask Madoff.

They didn't steal something. If you max out your credit cards and can't repay the company, one could say you stole something, but we don't consider that a crime, unless you intended to do so, by committing some sort of fraud. If I steal your credit card and use it, that is a criminal act.

Writing a cheque that won't cash because of lack of funds is a criminal act, seems like a better analogy.

Could be, as that is a criminal act. I was trying to show the differences. The Koch brothers have not committed any criminal acts that I know of. If they have, I think they should be arrested. I feel pretty certain they will. Ask the people that committed the fraud at Enron.

[Stooo]

Yes, if they stole something it is. Ask Madoff.

They didn't steal something. If you max out your credit cards and can't repay the company, one could say you stole something, but we don't consider that a crime, unless you intended to do so, by committing some sort of fraud. If I steal your credit card and use it, that is a criminal act.

Writing a cheque that won't cash because of lack of funds is a criminal act, seems like a better analogy.

Could be, as that is a criminal act. I was trying to show the differences. The Koch brothers have not committed any criminal acts that I know of. If they have, I think they should be arrested. I feel pretty certain they will. Ask the people that committed the fraud at Enron.

I doubt they'd return my email.

Time will tell with the protests and if they will actually help to redress the present system. At the end of the day a flood of corporate cash into our respective treasuries that has been withheld for so long can only benefit the working Joes of this World.

We wouldn't be any worse off.

[Maddog]

Yes, if they stole something it is. Ask Madoff.

They didn't steal something. If you max out your credit cards and can't repay the company, one could say you stole something, but we don't consider that a crime, unless you intended to do so, by committing some sort of fraud. If I steal your credit card and use it, that is a criminal act.

Writing a cheque that won't cash because of lack of funds is a criminal act, seems like a better analogy.

Could be, as that is a criminal act. I was trying to show the differences. The Koch brothers have not committed any criminal acts that I know of. If they have, I think they should be arrested. I feel pretty certain they will. Ask the people that committed the fraud at Enron.

I doubt they'd return my email.

Time will tell with the protests and if they will actually help to redress the present system. At the end of the day a flood of corporate cash into our respective treasuries that has been withheld for so long can only benefit the working Joes of this World.

We wouldn't be any worse off.

Yes we would, because those corporations provide jobs. Taking money from them won't help employment, nor increase wages. Handing the money over to politicians won't help us. They have enough money and have proven they can't manage the money they have already taken from us.

Becoming a slave on a government plantation does not appeal to me in the least. I don't want to hope that my master uses the fruits of my labor well and takes good care of me.

[Stooo]

Yes we would, because those corporations provide jobs. Taking money from them won't help employment, nor increase wages. Handing the money over to politicians won't help us. They have enough money and have proven they can't manage the money they have already taken from us.

Becoming a slave on a government plantation does not appeal to me in the least. I don't want to hope that my master uses the fruits of my labor well and takes good care of me.

Relocating the workforce to countries with lower wages and fewer safety laws as well as shifting the corporation base there to avoid taxes doesn't really help the host country either.

[Verum]

.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

You still have not posted any condemnation of these major thieves, polluters and bringers of death but are happy to denounce some poor sod camping in the cold.

[Maddog]

.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

You still have not posted any condemnation of these major thieves, polluters and bringers of death but are happy to denounce some poor sod camping in the cold.

I denounce all criminal activity. I don't care if some fool wants to camp out in the cold. In fact, I have been that fool before. Camped out numerous times, and did so per the laws and regulations of where I camped. If the Koch brothers commit a crime, they will be arrested, and it makes no difference if I condemn them. The legal system will deal with them.

[Verum]

.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

You still have not posted any condemnation of these major thieves, polluters and bringers of death but are happy to denounce some poor sod camping in the cold.

I denounce all criminal activity. I don't care if some fool wants to camp out in the cold. In fact, I have been that fool before. Camped out numerous times, and did so per the laws and regulations of where I camped. If the Koch brothers commit a crime, they will be arrested, and it makes no difference if I condemn them. The legal system will deal with them.

A carefully worded cop out. Bollocks to whether their offences are criminal or civil, do you condemn these thieves, polluters and bringers of death or not?

[Maddog]

.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

You still have not posted any condemnation of these major thieves, polluters and bringers of death but are happy to denounce some poor sod camping in the cold.

I denounce all criminal activity. I don't care if some fool wants to camp out in the cold. In fact, I have been that fool before. Camped out numerous times, and did so per the laws and regulations of where I camped. If the Koch brothers commit a crime, they will be arrested, and it makes no difference if I condemn them. The legal system will deal with them.

A carefully worded cop out. Bollocks to whether their offences are criminal or civil, do you condemn these thieves, polluters and bringers of death or not?

Almost every corporation doing business over here has been fined for something. GM, BP, American Airlines whoever. I don't get to all up in arms about that crap. It's part of doing business. We like to sue each other a lot.

Again, I condemn all criminal activity. You are the one that seems to want to pick and choose when it should be condemned.

[Verum]

.

Where have I defended anyone's right to commit criminal acts? I would say that I treat all people the same, regardless of what "percent" people want to lable them. I don't care how much money you have, or how little.

You still have not posted any condemnation of these major thieves, polluters and bringers of death but are happy to denounce some poor sod camping in the cold.

I denounce all criminal activity. I don't care if some fool wants to camp out in the cold. In fact, I have been that fool before. Camped out numerous times, and did so per the laws and regulations of where I camped. If the Koch brothers commit a crime, they will be arrested, and it makes no difference if I condemn them. The legal system will deal with them.

A carefully worded cop out. Bollocks to whether their offences are criminal or civil, do you condemn these thieves, polluters and bringers of death or not?

Almost every corporation doing business over here has been fined for something. GM, BP, American Airlines whoever. I don't get to all up in arms about that crap. It's part of doing business. We like to sue each other a lot.

Again, I condemn all criminal activity. You are the one that seems to want to pick and choose when it should be condemned.

Is the death of two teenagers and the theft of native american oil criminal to you or not? Simple question, stop hiding behind legal definitions and display some moral backbone.