Why there are Muslim ghettos in Belgium, but not in the US

[Maddog]

Muslim communities are not inherently predisposed to violence. The presence of a sizable Muslim population in a non-Muslim-majority country does not inevitably presage jihadist bloodshed or demands for the imposition of sharia. It is true that some 650,000 Muslims live in Belgium, but five times as many — 3.3 million — live in the United States. Why hasn’t America become a hotbed of Islamic extremism? Why aren’t American Muslims by the thousands flocking to fight for ISIS, Al Qaeda, and other terrorist organizations? Why, despite the efforts of Islamist pressure groups such as the Council on American-Islamic Relations — a Muslim supremacist operation that masquerades as an advocate for civil rights — are most American Muslims intent on adopting America’s customs and way of life?

The United States has been far more successful at assimilating and integrating Muslim immigrants into American society and culture than has Western Europe. There are no Muslim ghettoes here like those in Molenbeek or the Paris suburbs, where authorities turn a blind eye to antisocial behavior and aggressive incitement by radicals preaching jihad. Of course there have been some heinous exceptions, such as the Tsarnaev brothers, the Fort Hood shooter Nidal Hassan, or the killers in San Bernardino. And mosques in American cities have often been built with funding from Saudi Arabia, which promotes a harsh and puritanical version of Islam.

Nevertheless, at the grass-roots level, Muslims in the United States, like other cultural and religious minorities, have had no problem acclimating to mainstream norms. In a detailed 2011 survey, the Pew Research Center found that Muslim Americans are “highly assimilated into American society and . . . largely content with their lives.” More than 80 percent of US Muslims expressed satisfaction with life in America, and 63 percent said they felt no conflict “between being a devout Muslim and living in a modern society.” The rates at which they participate in various everyday American activities — from following local sports teams to watching entertainment TV — are similar to those of the American public generally. Half of all Muslim immigrants display the US flag at home, in the office, or on their car.

Given America’s wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the bloody battles with Islamic regimes and insurgents, and the threat to homeland security from “lone wolf” terror attacks, it might seem surprising that Muslims in Detroit or Brooklyn aren’t at least as alienated as those in Molenbeek. But they aren’t. For despite the rise of identity politics and the balkanizing pressures of multicultural correctness, America’s melting pot still works. Generations of Muslim immigrants have come to America to escape repression, poverty, or war in their homelands. The life they have made for themselves here has been freer, safer, more prosperous, and more embracing than the existence they left behind. There are tensions, but not enough to keep most Muslims from fitting themselves comfortably into the American mosaic.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/colu ... nt=event25

I kind of snagged this part out of the middle of the article. It's fairly interesting.

I can't speak for the rest of the US, but I know that in North Texas, the Muslim community is fairly spread out, and far from poor. That might have something to do with our immigration laws. There might be some crazy ones, but they are not huddled in some ghetto living in poverty.

[Trapper John]

Belgium isn't the only one - the Netherlands, France, Sweden, Denmark etc., all have them and they are even here in the UK but our governments refuse to acknowledge them as such - preferring to call them 'communities'

It's the weak leaders and governments we've had in Europe and the leaning the continent has had toward a Socialist-Liberal agenda, post WW2.

Europeans have always been petrified of another Hitler rising in Europe, it was the driving force which has led to the EU - the ridiculous part about it is - that their actions in the past 40-50 years regarding immigration, is setting the scene for exactly that which they are most scared of happening.

[Cannydc]

Yes, we have lots of 'communities', including in this area.

We call them 'Villages'....

[Maddog]

Belgium isn't the only one - the Netherlands, France, Sweden, Denmark etc., all have them and they are even here in the UK but our governments refuse to acknowledge them as such - preferring to call them 'communities'

It's the weak leaders and governments we've had in Europe and the leaning the continent has had toward a Socialist-Liberal agenda, post WW2.

Europeans have always been petrified of another Hitler rising in Europe, it was the driving force which has led to the EU - the ridiculous part about it is - that their actions in the past 40-50 years regarding immigration, is setting the scene for exactly that which they are most scared of happening.

I don't think they were ready for this at all. They were designed for non violent, fairly hard working group of people who tended to believe in being part of the greater good. These immigrants didn't buy into that.

[Keyser]

There are loads of 'communities' in the UK as well.

I hate that word - it is divisive and gives people automatic 'victim' status.

[rollup]

More Than 15 Armed Muslims Opened Fire In California! BREAKING NEWS

http://365usanews.com/u-s-news/more-tha ... king-news/

[Maddog]

More Than 15 Armed Muslims Opened Fire In California! BREAKING NEWS

http://365usanews.com/u-s-news/more-tha ... king-news/

Yet no weapons were found?

Some of the "News" sites over here are not very reliable.

I think this came across my Facebook a couple days ago.

[Fletch]

Brussels attacks: How Saudi Arabia's influence and a deal to get oil contracts sowed seeds of radicalism in Belgium

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 45996.html

Saudi, always Saudi somewhere in the equation. Until they are tackled, nothing will change.

[Maddog]

Brussels attacks: How Saudi Arabia's influence and a deal to get oil contracts sowed seeds of radicalism in Belgium

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world ... 45996.html

Saudi, always Saudi somewhere in the equation. Until they are tackled, nothing will change.

Could the Saudis radicalize you?

[Punk]

Muslim communities are not inherently predisposed to violence. The presence of a sizable Muslim population in a non-Muslim-majority country does not inevitably presage jihadist bloodshed or demands for the imposition of sharia. It is true that some 650,000 Muslims live in Belgium, but five times as many — 3.3 million — live in the United States. Why hasn’t America become a hotbed of Islamic extremism? Why aren’t American Muslims by the thousands flocking to fight for ISIS, Al Qaeda, and other terrorist organizations? Why, despite the efforts of Islamist pressure groups such as the Council on American-Islamic Relations — a Muslim supremacist operation that masquerades as an advocate for civil rights — are most American Muslims intent on adopting America’s customs and way of life?

The United States has been far more successful at assimilating and integrating Muslim immigrants into American society and culture than has Western Europe. There are no Muslim ghettoes here like those in Molenbeek or the Paris suburbs, where authorities turn a blind eye to antisocial behavior and aggressive incitement by radicals preaching jihad. Of course there have been some heinous exceptions, such as the Tsarnaev brothers, the Fort Hood shooter Nidal Hassan, or the killers in San Bernardino. And mosques in American cities have often been built with funding from Saudi Arabia, which promotes a harsh and puritanical version of Islam.

Nevertheless, at the grass-roots level, Muslims in the United States, like other cultural and religious minorities, have had no problem acclimating to mainstream norms. In a detailed 2011 survey, the Pew Research Center found that Muslim Americans are “highly assimilated into American society and . . . largely content with their lives.” More than 80 percent of US Muslims expressed satisfaction with life in America, and 63 percent said they felt no conflict “between being a devout Muslim and living in a modern society.” The rates at which they participate in various everyday American activities — from following local sports teams to watching entertainment TV — are similar to those of the American public generally. Half of all Muslim immigrants display the US flag at home, in the office, or on their car.

Given America’s wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the bloody battles with Islamic regimes and insurgents, and the threat to homeland security from “lone wolf” terror attacks, it might seem surprising that Muslims in Detroit or Brooklyn aren’t at least as alienated as those in Molenbeek. But they aren’t. For despite the rise of identity politics and the balkanizing pressures of multicultural correctness, America’s melting pot still works. Generations of Muslim immigrants have come to America to escape repression, poverty, or war in their homelands. The life they have made for themselves here has been freer, safer, more prosperous, and more embracing than the existence they left behind. There are tensions, but not enough to keep most Muslims from fitting themselves comfortably into the American mosaic.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/colu ... nt=event25

I kind of snagged this part out of the middle of the article. It's fairly interesting.

I can't speak for the rest of the US, but I know that in North Texas, the Muslim community is fairly spread out, and far from poor. That might have something to do with our immigration laws. There might be some crazy ones, but they are not huddled in some ghetto living in poverty.

My guess is that the US is a tad larger than Belgium and has a couple more cities. Am I right or am I right?

[Maddog]

Muslim communities are not inherently predisposed to violence. The presence of a sizable Muslim population in a non-Muslim-majority country does not inevitably presage jihadist bloodshed or demands for the imposition of sharia. It is true that some 650,000 Muslims live in Belgium, but five times as many — 3.3 million — live in the United States. Why hasn’t America become a hotbed of Islamic extremism? Why aren’t American Muslims by the thousands flocking to fight for ISIS, Al Qaeda, and other terrorist organizations? Why, despite the efforts of Islamist pressure groups such as the Council on American-Islamic Relations — a Muslim supremacist operation that masquerades as an advocate for civil rights — are most American Muslims intent on adopting America’s customs and way of life?

The United States has been far more successful at assimilating and integrating Muslim immigrants into American society and culture than has Western Europe. There are no Muslim ghettoes here like those in Molenbeek or the Paris suburbs, where authorities turn a blind eye to antisocial behavior and aggressive incitement by radicals preaching jihad. Of course there have been some heinous exceptions, such as the Tsarnaev brothers, the Fort Hood shooter Nidal Hassan, or the killers in San Bernardino. And mosques in American cities have often been built with funding from Saudi Arabia, which promotes a harsh and puritanical version of Islam.

Nevertheless, at the grass-roots level, Muslims in the United States, like other cultural and religious minorities, have had no problem acclimating to mainstream norms. In a detailed 2011 survey, the Pew Research Center found that Muslim Americans are “highly assimilated into American society and . . . largely content with their lives.” More than 80 percent of US Muslims expressed satisfaction with life in America, and 63 percent said they felt no conflict “between being a devout Muslim and living in a modern society.” The rates at which they participate in various everyday American activities — from following local sports teams to watching entertainment TV — are similar to those of the American public generally. Half of all Muslim immigrants display the US flag at home, in the office, or on their car.

Given America’s wars in Afghanistan and Iraq, the bloody battles with Islamic regimes and insurgents, and the threat to homeland security from “lone wolf” terror attacks, it might seem surprising that Muslims in Detroit or Brooklyn aren’t at least as alienated as those in Molenbeek. But they aren’t. For despite the rise of identity politics and the balkanizing pressures of multicultural correctness, America’s melting pot still works. Generations of Muslim immigrants have come to America to escape repression, poverty, or war in their homelands. The life they have made for themselves here has been freer, safer, more prosperous, and more embracing than the existence they left behind. There are tensions, but not enough to keep most Muslims from fitting themselves comfortably into the American mosaic.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/opinion/colu ... nt=event25

I kind of snagged this part out of the middle of the article. It's fairly interesting.

I can't speak for the rest of the US, but I know that in North Texas, the Muslim community is fairly spread out, and far from poor. That might have something to do with our immigration laws. There might be some crazy ones, but they are not huddled in some ghetto living in poverty.

My guess is that the US is a tad larger than Belgium and has a couple more cities. Am I right or am I right?

Both of those are correct, but hardly relevant. The US is no stranger to ghettos.

[Ray of Sunshine]

No Muslim ghettos in Dearborn, Michigan?

[Dinkydoobie]

I'll take what is population density for 500 alex. To draw a comparison you would need to have about 15-20 million muslims in the US.

[Maddog]

No Muslim ghettos in Dearborn, Michigan?

Depends on what you call a ghetto. Dearborn is a very Muslim community, but it's not plagued with unemployment and crime.

From what I understand, many immigrants to Europe are barred from working for a while. Here, they have to work as there is little in the way of assistance for them. It's a lot harder to radicalize someone, when they are getting up and going to work every day.

[Maddog]

http://www.city-data.com/crime/crime-De ... higan.html

Overall, murder and violent crime in Dearborn are lower than the national average and property crime is a little higher. This is a city located next door to the murder capital of the country (Detroit).

You are safe in Dearborn. Not so much in Molenbeek.