NHS IN CRISIS

Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Cannydc » Tue Jan 09, 2018 8:08 pm

Viper wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
Avon Barksdale wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
I see we've improved by 5 spots since the Gordon Brown days
Obviously these Conservative governments are doing a better job than Labour did.


Just as a point of full disclosure those figure were good to 2014 (I couldn't get the up to date figures as I am not a subscriber)


According to this article, in 2016 we had climbed to 17th:

http://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1848


More conservative success stories :cuppaT:


Any idea why, under Thatcher's Tories, waiting times for many operations rose to several years ?

Why hospitals were in such a bad state, many were on the point of being condemned ?

Why we were 10s of thousands short of doctors and nurses ?

Why thousands more died every year under the Tories ?

Of course..........just another Tory success story.

"By the 1980s, under Margaret Thatcher, waiting times in the NHS became so long that Labour started to make political capital out of it. Thatcher confirmed the public suspicion that the Tories didn’t care about the NHS by choosing to be treated privately. When she was challenged about this, she said she took out insurance “to enable me to go into hospital on the day I want, at the time I want, and with a doctor I want.” That’s all very well, thought many voters, but what about the vast majority of people who cannot afford private health care?"

Remember the crisis at Birmingham Children's hospital where heart operations had been postponed for lack of funding putting young lives at risk. The NHS had lurched from crisis to crisis during the 1980s and the Government had once more been forced to seek an extra £100 million from the Treasury to bale it out.

"Always by February and March it was money running out that caused theatre and ward closures, with surgeons left to twiddle their thumbs while waiting lists spiked up until the new financial year.

Look back down memory lane at some of the headlines before Blair came to power: “400 critically ill children turned away from intensive care units in the past three months due to a chronic shortage of beds and nurses” (Mirror, 21 January 1997). “1 in 7 operations cancelled due to cutbacks” (Mirror, 18 November 1996). “Chaos mounts as wards turn away the sick” (News of the World, 28 January 1996), ”Doctors reveal winter chaos in NHS” (Independent, 10 January 1997). Pictures of patients on trolleys abound among the old cuttings.

Plenty of Tory success stories there....
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby MungoBrush » Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:36 pm

Cannydc wrote:
Viper wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
Avon Barksdale wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
I see we've improved by 5 spots since the Gordon Brown days
Obviously these Conservative governments are doing a better job than Labour did.


Just as a point of full disclosure those figure were good to 2014 (I couldn't get the up to date figures as I am not a subscriber)


According to this article, in 2016 we had climbed to 17th:

http://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1848


More conservative success stories :cuppaT:


Any idea why, under Thatcher's Tories, waiting times for many operations rose to several years ?

Why hospitals were in such a bad state, many were on the point of being condemned ?

Why we were 10s of thousands short of doctors and nurses ?

Why thousands more died every year under the Tories ?

Of course..........just another Tory success story.

"By the 1980s, under Margaret Thatcher, waiting times in the NHS became so long that Labour started to make political capital out of it. Thatcher confirmed the public suspicion that the Tories didn’t care about the NHS by choosing to be treated privately. When she was challenged about this, she said she took out insurance “to enable me to go into hospital on the day I want, at the time I want, and with a doctor I want.” That’s all very well, thought many voters, but what about the vast majority of people who cannot afford private health care?"

Remember the crisis at Birmingham Children's hospital where heart operations had been postponed for lack of funding putting young lives at risk. The NHS had lurched from crisis to crisis during the 1980s and the Government had once more been forced to seek an extra £100 million from the Treasury to bale it out.

"Always by February and March it was money running out that caused theatre and ward closures, with surgeons left to twiddle their thumbs while waiting lists spiked up until the new financial year.

Look back down memory lane at some of the headlines before Blair came to power: “400 critically ill children turned away from intensive care units in the past three months due to a chronic shortage of beds and nurses” (Mirror, 21 January 1997). “1 in 7 operations cancelled due to cutbacks” (Mirror, 18 November 1996). “Chaos mounts as wards turn away the sick” (News of the World, 28 January 1996), ”Doctors reveal winter chaos in NHS” (Independent, 10 January 1997). Pictures of patients on trolleys abound among the old cuttings.

Plenty of Tory success stories there....


Wow!
You've got to go back more than 20 years to dig up some whataboutery on the Convservatives.
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Viper » Tue Jan 09, 2018 9:58 pm

Cannydc wrote:
Viper wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
Avon Barksdale wrote:
MungoBrush wrote:
I see we've improved by 5 spots since the Gordon Brown days
Obviously these Conservative governments are doing a better job than Labour did.


Just as a point of full disclosure those figure were good to 2014 (I couldn't get the up to date figures as I am not a subscriber)


According to this article, in 2016 we had climbed to 17th:

http://www.bmj.com/content/353/bmj.i1848


More conservative success stories :cuppaT:


Any idea why, under Thatcher's Tories, waiting times for many operations rose to several years ?

Why hospitals were in such a bad state, many were on the point of being condemned ?

Why we were 10s of thousands short of doctors and nurses ?

Why thousands more died every year under the Tories ?

Of course..........just another Tory success story.

"By the 1980s, under Margaret Thatcher, waiting times in the NHS became so long that Labour started to make political capital out of it. Thatcher confirmed the public suspicion that the Tories didn’t care about the NHS by choosing to be treated privately. When she was challenged about this, she said she took out insurance “to enable me to go into hospital on the day I want, at the time I want, and with a doctor I want.” That’s all very well, thought many voters, but what about the vast majority of people who cannot afford private health care?"

Remember the crisis at Birmingham Children's hospital where heart operations had been postponed for lack of funding putting young lives at risk. The NHS had lurched from crisis to crisis during the 1980s and the Government had once more been forced to seek an extra £100 million from the Treasury to bale it out.

"Always by February and March it was money running out that caused theatre and ward closures, with surgeons left to twiddle their thumbs while waiting lists spiked up until the new financial year.

Look back down memory lane at some of the headlines before Blair came to power: “400 critically ill children turned away from intensive care units in the past three months due to a chronic shortage of beds and nurses” (Mirror, 21 January 1997). “1 in 7 operations cancelled due to cutbacks” (Mirror, 18 November 1996). “Chaos mounts as wards turn away the sick” (News of the World, 28 January 1996), ”Doctors reveal winter chaos in NHS” (Independent, 10 January 1997). Pictures of patients on trolleys abound among the old cuttings.

Plenty of Tory success stories there....


I think there is precedent on here that stooo bins anything older than 2 weeks. So cant really see much point in this.

Does display your butthurt though.
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Viper » Tue Jan 09, 2018 10:18 pm

Also far left SNP administered scottish health service (significantly higher funded per head) lags behind conservative administered english NHS.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc. ... d-42620167

Conservative success stories :cuppaT:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Cannydc » Wed Jan 10, 2018 7:05 pm

Viper wrote:Also far left SNP administered scottish health service (significantly higher funded per head) lags behind conservative administered english NHS.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc. ... d-42620167

Conservative success stories :cuppaT:


Strange, that. There are no comparisons between English and Scottish NHSs in your link, except this;

England had a 155% rise in long A+E waits between 2012/3 and this year, up to 2.5 million a year.

Hospitals in Wales and Northern Ireland also saw an increase over the period.

In Scotland, the number of patients waiting more than four hours fell by 9% to just over 100,000.

Another Tory success story ?? Oh....wait..... There's more....

Latest available figures from 18 months ago - spending per head for NHS

Scotland £2,160
N. Ireland £2,125
Wales £2,084
England £2,057

It must also be noted that "In England spending on health has remained relatively flat and in Scotland it has fallen by £51 per person" over that period. It is fair to assume that this particular trend has not been reversed, so the gap between England and Scotland, which was £103 18 months ago is likely to be even less now.

So, it seems that we must celebrate 'flat spending on health' as "Another Tory success story" ??

Don't make me laugh.

https://www.nuffieldtrust.org.uk/chart/ ... -of-the-uk
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:23 pm

Cannydc wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:
Ok. When you say misuse of antibiotics do you mean using them when unnecessary like a cough being just a cough not a chest infection? Children used to be prescribed antibiotics straight away when I was young, ( that delicious banana flavoured one.) You don't see that happen so often now.


Yes, exactly.

My daughter was always on the banana medicine, until grommets in both ears stopped the ear infections completely. Bacterial infections, of course.

Nowadays we should be letting kids get over coughs and colds in nature's own good time. And once they have had a cold virus, they won't get that one again. Pity there are over 200 varieties of the common cold.


Agreed.
Also, there needs to be more knowledge about alternative remedies/ preventers of illnesses.
Eg. Our gut fauna/flora plays a big part in our general health but people know little about it.
A Yalult a day.....keeps the dr away. :smilin:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:43 pm

Yakult.
Bloody autocorrect!
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Big Fat Frosty » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:48 pm

take fluoride out of the water
add vit d to the water
:thumbsup:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:49 pm

You'd still need something to kill the germs in the water.
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Big Fat Frosty » Wed Jan 10, 2018 10:54 pm

Lady Murasaki wrote:You'd still need something to kill the germs in the water.

fluoride was suppose to prevent teeth cavities
fuck all to do with water purification
:thumbsup:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:01 pm

Big Fat Frosty wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:You'd still need something to kill the germs in the water.

fluoride was suppose to prevent teeth cavities
fuck all to do with water purification
:thumbsup:


I knew that. I meant you need something to prevent cavities in the water.
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Big Fat Frosty » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:03 pm

Lady Murasaki wrote:
Big Fat Frosty wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:You'd still need something to kill the germs in the water.

fluoride was suppose to prevent teeth cavities
fuck all to do with water purification
:thumbsup:


I knew that. I meant you need something to prevent cavities in the water.

do you..
fluoride does fuck all to prevent cavities
brushing your teeth and flossing
works far better
:thumbsup:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:07 pm

Big Fat Frosty wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:
Big Fat Frosty wrote:
Lady Murasaki wrote:You'd still need something to kill the germs in the water.

fluoride was suppose to prevent teeth cavities
fuck all to do with water purification
:thumbsup:


I knew that. I meant you need something to prevent cavities in the water.

do you..
fluoride alone does fuck all to prevent cavities
brushing your teeth and flossing
works far better
:thumbsup:


Yet tooth decay in this country is worse than ever.
I suppose fluoride in the water can't combat sugar consumption.
Ok fluoride out, vit d and c in.
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Big Fat Frosty » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:07 pm

it does however slowly poison poor people
with poor health
ending in an earlier death
:thumbsup:
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Re: NHS IN CRISIS

Postby Lady Murasaki » Wed Jan 10, 2018 11:13 pm

Why would it poison poor people more than anyone else?
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