Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:33 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:Staines proposed a pact with the BNP - why do you trust and defend him?


As a person I do not defend him

I like the site that exposes stories

See the difference?

Corbyn sided with antisemites

Are you going to disown him for that?

Why do you defend him?

See how your failed logic works?


"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

Is there a difference? If you say so. :dunno:
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Guest » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:33 am

McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Aside from mocking the mentally afflicted, you have trolled, spammed and deflected - I don't mind in the slightest, it defeats any point you think you are making - please continue.


You make many unfounded claims and have not even debated many of the points i raised

I will ask again.

Are you mentally afflicted?

Yes or No?

You stated you were a qualified psychologist ( :gigglesnshit: ) and posted this...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads



I do think you are a tad slow

I have also asked if you are mentally afflicted.

Are you?


I must be if you, a qualified psychologist, say so...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


:dunno:



:gigglesnshit:
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:35 am

McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Aside from mocking the mentally afflicted, you have trolled, spammed and deflected - I don't mind in the slightest, it defeats any point you think you are making - please continue.


You make many unfounded claims and have not even debated many of the points i raised

I will ask again.

Are you mentally afflicted?

Yes or No?

You stated you were a qualified psychologist ( :gigglesnshit: ) and posted this...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads



I do think you are a tad slow

I have also asked if you are mentally afflicted.

Are you?


I must be if you, a qualified psychologist, say so...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


:dunno:



Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:36 am

McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:Staines proposed a pact with the BNP - why do you trust and defend him?


As a person I do not defend him

I like the site that exposes stories

See the difference?

Corbyn sided with antisemites

Are you going to disown him for that?

Why do you defend him?

See how your failed logic works?


"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

Is there a difference? If you say so. :dunno:


Come again?

The above makes zero sense

I see you avoid all points, so lets go back to basics

Do you back Corbyn?

Yes or no
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Didge
 
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:36 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:I must be if you, a qualified psychologist, say so...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


:dunno:



Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?

I refer you to your earlier diagnosis - and my acknowledgement of your expertise.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:39 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:As a person I do not defend him

I like the site that exposes stories

See the difference?

Corbyn sided with antisemites

Are you going to disown him for that?

Why do you defend him?

See how your failed logic works?


"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

Is there a difference? If you say so. :dunno:


Come again?

The above makes zero sense

I see you avoid all points, so lets go back to basics

Do you back Corbyn?

Yes or no


It makes perfect sense - you defend Staines' writings but not the man - thus...

"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

...mirrors your distinction perfectly.
Last edited by McAz on Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:40 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:40 am

McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:I must be if you, a qualified psychologist, say so...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


:dunno:



Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?

I refer you to your earlier diagnosis - and my acknowledgement of your expertise.


Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?
User avatar
Didge
 
Posts: 777
Joined: Mon Sep 12, 2016 2:06 pm

Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:40 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:I must be if you, a qualified psychologist, say so...

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


:dunno:



Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?

I refer you to your earlier diagnosis - and my acknowledgement of your expertise.


Are you menatlly afflicted?

Yes or no?

Not menatlly - but unlike yourself I am not qualified to say. :gigglesnshit:
Last edited by McAz on Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:41 am

McAz wrote:It makes perfect sense - you defend Staines' writings but not the man - thus...

"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

...mirrors your distinction perfectly.



Do you support Corbyn?

Yes or No?
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Didge
 
Posts: 777
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:42 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:It makes perfect sense - you defend Staines' writings but not the man - thus...

"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

...mirrors your distinction perfectly.



Do you support Corbyn?

Yes or No?


Define support?
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McAz
 
Posts: 29093
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:43 am

McAz wrote:Unlike yourself I am not qualified to say.



So you admit to not being qualified and yet claim, i am insulting the mentally afflicted, by calling "you" a tad slow

So are you not a tad slow?

Priceless fuckwittery at best
Last edited by Didge on Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:44 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Gigabit » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:44 am

I really must go to bed but interesting article from the FT.


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https://www.ft.com/content/f7619e96-3cc ... 94fa33a81e

Last month, a High Court judge in London said it was “unclear” whether the former Russian spy Sergei Skripal and his daughter, Yulia, would ever recover from being poisoned with a military-grade nerve agent.

But on Tuesday, the hospital in Salisbury where the pair have been receiving treatment since they first fell ill on a park bench more than five weeks ago confirmed that Ms Skripal had been discharged. The hospital’s medical director said Mr Skripal is likely to be released “in due course”.

Their recovery is the latest twist in a story that has plunged relations between Russia and the west into their biggest freeze since the end of the cold war, sparking tit-for-tat spy expulsions and a wave of claims and counter claims between Moscow and London.

The Organisation for the Prohibition of Chemical Weapons is expected to deliver its independent assessment as soon as Wednesday of the UK’s claim that the nerve agent used in the attack was from the novichok group of chemical weapons that were developed by the Soviet Union.

The OPCW’s verdict will be seen as a vital moment for the UK government, as it seeks to repudiate claims from Moscow that Britain has no evidence to blame Russia for the attack.

Ms Skripal’s release from hospital nevertheless poses difficult questions for the UK authorities, including how to keep the pair secure as investigators race to identify the individuals who might have targeted them.

Security officials are hopeful that despite being heavily sedated for more than a month, the Skripals may be able to share crucial evidence that will aid in their investigation.

Officials said Ms Skripal’s status as both a witness and a victim meant it was the police’s responsibility to keep her safe now that she has been discharged from hospital.

The Metropolitan Police’s counter terrorism unit declined to comment. The Home Office also declined to comment on Russian media reports that Ms Skripal had already applied for asylum in the UK. There have also been reports that security services in the UK are exploring whether the pair could be resettled in the US.

One former security official said MI6 would wait to see how Mr Skripal recovered before deciding their next steps. “It’s his choice,” the former official said. “They can’t resettle one without the other.”

Ms Skripal’s fate may also hinge on whether she wants to return to Russia. Her cousin, Victoria Skripal, has told Russian media that she wants to return home, while the Russian embassy in London has requested to see her.

Following the news of Ms Skripal’s release from hospital, the embassy posted a barrage of tweets again attacking the UK’s handling of the affair.

“We congratulate Yulia Skripal on her recovery,” the embassy tweeted. “Yet we need urgent proof that what is being done to her is done on her own free will.”

In a later statement, the embassy said any attempt to resettle the Skripals in the US or with any of the UK’s other close intelligence allies would be a “gross violation of international law”, adding that the world “will have every reason to see this as an abduction”.

UK government and security officials said the comments were another example of Russia’s attempts to distract and deflect attention from its role in the Salisbury attack.

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The Skripals’ return to health has surprised some officials and chemical weapons experts who just two weeks ago had feared the worst. But it remains unclear what the long-term effects of their poisoning may be.

“They may have psychological problems,” said Alastair Hay, a chemical weapons specialist from Leeds university. “People exposed to nerve agents suffer post-traumatic stress disorder and can get insomnia. But as long as there has been no damage to the brain from oxygen starvation then their cognitive function should be fine.”

UK security officials say the way that the Skripals were exposed to the poison may explain their relatively rapid return to health.

Delivery via an aerosol spray or through ingestion would have almost certainly killed them, according to one UK security official. But police believe the Skripals came into contact with the nerve agent through a gel smeared on the handle of the front door to Mr Skripal’s house.

Absorption through the skin takes much longer and might have allowed the Skripals crucial time to metabolise the poison, the official said.

Outlining the treatment that the pair had received on Tuesday, Dr Christine Blanshard, medical director of Salisbury Hospital, said the pair had “responded exceptionally”.

“Our job is to stabilise them, ensuring they can breathe and that blood can continue to circulate,” said Dr Blanshard. “We then needed to use a variety of different drugs to support the patient until they can create enough enzymes to replace those affected by the poison.”

Chemists raise questions over novichok claims
Some chemistry experts are uneasy about the way politicians informed the public about the novichok nerve agent used to poison Sergei Skripal and his daughter, Yulia, writes Clive Cookson.

In particular, chemists said, there is no way to link traces of novichok collected from the crime scene with a particular manufacturing site using science alone, without the use of intelligence sources.

The novichok agents are relatively simple organophosphorus compounds that competent chemists could make from globally traded ingredients, if they had a specific molecular target in mind.

“The whole family of novichoks are quite easy to make,” said Phil Parsons, an organic chemistry professor at Imperial College London. “You could synthesise them in any good chemistry lab, though you would have to take stringent safety precautions to prevent the staff being poisoned.”

Details of several novichok agents have been available on the internet for years. The UK government has not officially said which one poisoned the Skripals. Vladimir Uglev, a member of the Soviet team that developed novichoks, said he had no doubt it was A-234, a view shared unofficially by experts in the UK. But there has been uncertainty about the precise structure of A-234.

A number of chemists said they did not want to throw doubt on the government’s claim that Russia was responsible for attack on the Skripals, but that the public should not regard novichoks as ultra-sophisticated chemical weapons that could not be made elsewhere. They also regarded the phrase “military grade”, applied to the nerve agent in some government statements, as meaningless in this context, since there exists no known lesser grade of the agent.

Professor Andrea Sella of University College London said: “The Russians have run a ferocious misinformation campaign and some UK politicians have inadvertently helped them. Boris Johnson has sometimes seemed like a babe in the woods.”

Novichoks (named after the Russian word for “newcomer”) were developed in the former Soviet Union during the 1970s and 1980s, in a project to make nerve agents that would be lethal in even smaller doses than compounds such as sarin or soman. They work in the same way, by blocking an enzyme called acetylcholinesterase that is essential for the human nervous system to function.


https://www.ft.com/content/f7619e96-3cc ... 94fa33a81e

Once we have conclusive, hard, evidence, I will be the first to condemn Russia. But I don't believe we have it yet. That is my opinion, it's not because Corbyn nor anyone else thinks it, it is just what I believe. Maybe I'm wrong but I have looked at a variety of sources and I just don't have enough evidence to point the finger at Russia. End of story.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby Didge » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:44 am

McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:It makes perfect sense - you defend Staines' writings but not the man - thus...

"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

...mirrors your distinction perfectly.



Do you support Corbyn?

Yes or No?


Define support?


Vote, defend etc
User avatar
Didge
 
Posts: 777
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:46 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:Unlike yourself I am not qualified to say.



So you admit to not being qualified and yet claim, i am insulting the mentally afflicted, by calling "you" a tad slow

So are you not a tad slow?

Priceless fuckwittery at best

No-one needs to be qualified to recognise your mockery.

Didge wrote:.. you must be a tad slow, sorry about that and hope you recover soon
...I clearly understand you do have issues and it explains loads


Disgusting from someone who supposedly champions human rights.
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Re: Former Russian spy critical ~"unknown substance"

Postby McAz » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:47 am

Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:
Didge wrote:
McAz wrote:It makes perfect sense - you defend Staines' writings but not the man - thus...

"I defend Mein Kampf but not the man who wrote it".

...mirrors your distinction perfectly.



Do you support Corbyn?

Yes or No?


Define support?


Vote, defend etc

I will be voting Labour, LibDem or Green at the next election depending on how best to unseat the sitting Tory.
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McAz
 
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