Mungo's monetary musings.

[Cactus Jack]

It's actually very simple.
If I borrow fifty grand off the bank where does the fifty grand come from?

Let's answer that by asking why it's called a bank?

Don't worry I'll assume you know the answer and confirm that it's because sealed pots were literally buried in the bank of a river - and these pots contained not gold or silver but seed.

An amount of what people produced was taken and placed into 'the bank' so that if a disaster came there would be a source of seed - and hence the opportunity to allow the bank's clients to restock their fields,

Banks would lend seed in the expectation that the grower could successfully grow the seed and repay at least the amount borrowed and usually a bit more. So the fifty grand you are lent comes from the banks belief that you can repay 50 grand - whether that belief is well founded or not is a different matter.

[Fletch]

Oh dear, he's off his meds again.

[Cactus Jack]

Oh dear, he's off his meds again.

Is that all you've got Fletch - I gave you the opportunity to grace us with your wisdom and you gave us a two year old's recitation of someone else's words you thought meant something.

Mungo is right about you. As is Canny, Maddog, Raven, stoo and just about everyone else on this forum.

[Rolluplostinspace]

It's actually very simple.
If I borrow fifty grand off the bank where does the fifty grand come from?

Let's answer that by asking why it's called a bank?

Don't worry I'll assume you know the answer and confirm that it's because sealed pots were literally buried in the bank of a river - and these pots contained not gold or silver but seed.

An amount of what people produced was taken and placed into 'the bank' so that if a disaster came there would be a source of seed - and hence the opportunity to allow the bank's clients to restock their fields,

Banks would lend seed in the expectation that the grower could successfully grow the seed and repay at least the amount borrowed and usually a bit more. So the fifty grand you are lent comes from the banks belief that you can repay 50 grand - whether that belief is well founded or not is a different matter.

Not a story I've heard before.
Interesting but not very a very bright place to store valuables I would have thought.
Ok keep it simple .... where do the bank get the fifty grand from?

[Cactus Jack]

It's actually very simple.
If I borrow fifty grand off the bank where does the fifty grand come from?

Let's answer that by asking why it's called a bank?

Don't worry I'll assume you know the answer and confirm that it's because sealed pots were literally buried in the bank of a river - and these pots contained not gold or silver but seed.

An amount of what people produced was taken and placed into 'the bank' so that if a disaster came there would be a source of seed - and hence the opportunity to allow the bank's clients to restock their fields,

Banks would lend seed in the expectation that the grower could successfully grow the seed and repay at least the amount borrowed and usually a bit more. So the fifty grand you are lent comes from the banks belief that you can repay 50 grand - whether that belief is well founded or not is a different matter.

Not a story I've heard before.
Interesting but not very a very bright place to store valuables I would have thought.
Ok keep it simple .... where do the bank get the fifty grand from?

You - and they get extra on top by charging you interest

[Rolluplostinspace]

It's actually very simple.
If I borrow fifty grand off the bank where does the fifty grand come from?

Let's answer that by asking why it's called a bank?

Don't worry I'll assume you know the answer and confirm that it's because sealed pots were literally buried in the bank of a river - and these pots contained not gold or silver but seed.

An amount of what people produced was taken and placed into 'the bank' so that if a disaster came there would be a source of seed - and hence the opportunity to allow the bank's clients to restock their fields,

Banks would lend seed in the expectation that the grower could successfully grow the seed and repay at least the amount borrowed and usually a bit more. So the fifty grand you are lent comes from the banks belief that you can repay 50 grand - whether that belief is well founded or not is a different matter.

Not a story I've heard before.
Interesting but not very a very bright place to store valuables I would have thought.
Ok keep it simple .... where do the bank get the fifty grand from?

You - and they get extra on top by charging you interest

Totally wrong.
They taught this for years to get away with their fraudulent trick of ... creating money out of thin air.
They do not lend you other peoples money.
They do not lend you money they have sitting there.
The minute you sign for the fifty grand loan a new fifty thousand pounds has just been created and injected into the economy.
Where did it come from .... your signature created it out of thin air .... it didn't exist
till you borrowed it meaning it came from nothing but with interest attached.
The bullshit that you borrow other peoples money was exposed finally some years ago thanks to the internet.

[Cactus Jack]

It's actually very simple.
If I borrow fifty grand off the bank where does the fifty grand come from?

Let's answer that by asking why it's called a bank?

Don't worry I'll assume you know the answer and confirm that it's because sealed pots were literally buried in the bank of a river - and these pots contained not gold or silver but seed.

An amount of what people produced was taken and placed into 'the bank' so that if a disaster came there would be a source of seed - and hence the opportunity to allow the bank's clients to restock their fields,

Banks would lend seed in the expectation that the grower could successfully grow the seed and repay at least the amount borrowed and usually a bit more. So the fifty grand you are lent comes from the banks belief that you can repay 50 grand - whether that belief is well founded or not is a different matter.

Not a story I've heard before.
Interesting but not very a very bright place to store valuables I would have thought.
Ok keep it simple .... where do the bank get the fifty grand from?

You - and they get extra on top by charging you interest

Totally wrong.
They taught this for years to get away with their fraudulent trick of ... creating money out of thin air.
They do not lend you other peoples money.
They do not lend you money they have sitting there.
The minute you sign for the fifty grand loan a new fifty thousand pounds has just been created and injected into the economy.
Where did it come from .... your signature created it out of thin air .... it didn't exist
till you borrowed it meaning it came from nothing but with interest attached.
The bullshit that you borrow other peoples money was exposed finally some years ago thanks to the internet.

You obviously didn't understand what I said.

The fifty grand you borrow from them comes from you - future you to be exact - and it either isn't just fifty grand or it's nothing but we won't know which until after it's either repaid or defaulted on.

We live in a world where money is not dissimilar to Schrodinger's cat.

[Fletch]

You're talking in riddles CJ. All money is created as debt by private banks. No debt = no money. The power to create money was handed to private banks from the state in 1666.

One could slash private debt by 100pc of GDP, boost growth, stabilize prices, and dethrone bankers all at the same time. It could be done cleanly and painlessly, by legislative command, far more quickly than anybody imagined.

The conjuring trick is to replace our system of private bank-created money -- roughly 97pc of the money supply -- with state-created money. We return to the historical norm, before Charles II placed control of the money supply in private hands with the English Free Coinage Act of 1666.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/com ... nkers.html

Not only is money created out of thin air (on a computer) but that created money is then extinguished on repayment with the bank keeping the interest paid on it.

That means to get the money back in to the economy, a loan has to be taken out by someone. Hence the no debt = no money.

Pounds are either circulating government debt, or they’re created by banks by making loans. That’s where money comes from. Obviously if nobody took out any loans at all, there wouldn’t be any money. The economy would collapse.

So there has to be debt.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... ry-surplus

If you or mungo disagree with the facts, then say what you believe the case to be without tales of the riverbank or evasion.

[Cactus Jack]

You're talking in riddles CJ.

It's not a riddle - it's as simple as simple can be when you're not trying to put your spin on it.

The money supply is locus of perceived confidence in future production, factoring in a geographical imbalance between where production to consumption happen of course.

[Fletch]

You're talking in riddles CJ.

It's not a riddle - it's as simple as simple can be when you're not trying to put your spin on it.

The money supply is locus of perceived confidence in future production, factoring in a geographical imbalance between where production to consumption happen of course.

Nope, it just depends on people and governments taking on debt,

No debt = No money.

A return to state issued money as a unit of value instead of a unit of debt would make the world a much better and fairer one. It would also solve the issue of the interest never being created. Another issue you avoid answering.

All money is issued as debt by private banks but the interest payable on it is never created. Where will it come from?

[Cactus Jack]

You're talking in riddles CJ.

It's not a riddle - it's as simple as simple can be when you're not trying to put your spin on it.

The money supply is locus of perceived confidence in future production, factoring in a geographical imbalance between where production to consumption happen of course.

Nope, it just depends on people and governments taking on debt,

No debt = No money.

A return to state issued money as a unit of value instead of a unit of debt would make the world a much better and fairer one. It would also solve the issue of the interest never being created. Another issue you avoid answering.

All money is issued as debt by private banks but the interest payable on it is never created. Where will it come from?

You can spout that shit a million times and it doesn't make it anything more than the ramblings of half-baked fool

[MungoBrush]

All money is created as debt by private banks. No debt = no money.

Completely wrong
Absolute bullshit
Total bollox.

[Rolluplostinspace]

You're talking in riddles CJ.

It's not a riddle - it's as simple as simple can be when you're not trying to put your spin on it.

The money supply is locus of perceived confidence in future production, factoring in a geographical imbalance between where production to consumption happen of course.

Nope, it just depends on people and governments taking on debt,

No debt = No money.

A return to state issued money as a unit of value instead of a unit of debt would make the world a much better and fairer one. It would also solve the issue of the interest never being created. Another issue you avoid answering.

All money is issued as debt by private banks but the interest payable on it is never created. Where will it come from?

You can spout that shit a million times and it doesn't make it anything more than the ramblings of half-baked fool

You're the one looking stupid here because what he said is what it is.
I find it difficult to understand why anyone can be left in the world who still don't know this.

[Rolluplostinspace]

All money is created as debt by private banks. No debt = no money.

Completely wrong
Absolute bullshit
Total bollox.

An admission at last that you don't fucking know.

[Fletch]

All money is created as debt by private banks. No debt = no money.

Completely wrong
Absolute bullshit
Total bollox.

If you or mungo disagree with the facts, then say what you believe the case to be without tales of the riverbank or evasion.