Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sat Jan 12, 2019 11:12 am

“Not only will this tax plan pay for itself but it will pay down debt,” That's what Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin famously boasted in September - well now we have the data, collected and collated by Steve Mnuchin's own department, and we can see whether he was right or wrong

Tax Cuts.png


Let's start with the good news. The economy definitely did grow, and even if you wanted to argue that it merely continued to grow advocates for the tax cut could argue, based on the figures, that the cuts boosted growth.

That's the good news. The bad news is the boost to the economy didn't come near to paying for the tax cuts. In fact by the most moderate of estimates they fell by around $83 billion.

For information: The way most economists “score” a tax proposal is to ask how it would change revenue levels compared to what you would expect the government to collect if the tax cut had not passed — what economists call a “baseline.” What the Treasury Department will have done is taken its projections for economic growth and revenue, and inevitably they will have taken the most pessimistic projections to give the new scenario the best chance to look good, and then compare the situation with what has actually happened.

What Steve Mnuchin's department has done is provide evidence that the average US citizen would have been better off if the tax cuts had never happened.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/11/busi ... venue.html
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Maddog » Sat Jan 12, 2019 5:55 pm

The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:03 pm

Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby calitom » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:06 pm

Cactus Jack wrote:“Not only will this tax plan pay for itself but it will pay down debt,” That's what Treasury Secretary Steve Mnuchin famously boasted in September - well now we have the data, collected and collated by Steve Mnuchin's own department, and we can see whether he was right or wrong

Tax Cuts.png


Let's start with the good news. The economy definitely did grow, and even if you wanted to argue that it merely continued to grow advocates for the tax cut could argue, based on the figures, that the cuts boosted growth.

That's the good news. The bad news is the boost to the economy didn't come near to paying for the tax cuts. In fact by the most moderate of estimates they fell by around $83 billion.

For information: The way most economists “score” a tax proposal is to ask how it would change revenue levels compared to what you would expect the government to collect if the tax cut had not passed — what economists call a “baseline.” What the Treasury Department will have done is taken its projections for economic growth and revenue, and inevitably they will have taken the most pessimistic projections to give the new scenario the best chance to look good, and then compare the situation with what has actually happened.

What Steve Mnuchin's department has done is provide evidence that the average US citizen would have been better off if the tax cuts had never happened.

https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/11/busi ... venue.html


taxes collected in 2018 are mostly for 2017 taxes when the tax plan was not even in existence.so im not sure what you are talking about. the main tax cuts were for small businesses who pay 4th quarter estimates in jan 2019 and the remainder on or before apr 15th 2019...and small s and c's and llc's wait even longer-late summer 2019- The others who had pay cuts were mainly those in the lower brackets.And their withholdings will count for 2018. The decrease in marginal tax rates for the wealthier people were largely neutralized due to the changes in law re: standard and itemized deductions incl deductibility of mortgage interest above 10k.Those taxes wont be paid until april 2019 or late summer/early fall 2019. So the New York Times i again talking out of its ass.
PS projected revenue for tax yr 2018 is projected as 83 billion Above 2017.So they couldnt even get a false premise correct.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Maddog » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:14 pm

Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good



The economy is fine after the tax cuts. Imagine how great it would be with real ones. :thumbsup:
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Fletch » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:24 pm

Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good



The economy is fine after the tax cuts. Imagine how great it would be with real ones. :thumbsup:


Why don't you think you should contribute to the running of the modern country you are happy to live in?
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:25 pm

Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good



The economy is fine after the tax cuts. Imagine how great it would be with real ones. :thumbsup:

So, as I said before, you think you know better than a Treasury Department that trying to make their boss look good, but couldn't because the Repugnant Ones are spending more money than their earning and plan to earn less in future.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Maddog » Sat Jan 12, 2019 6:53 pm

Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good



The economy is fine after the tax cuts. Imagine how great it would be with real ones. :thumbsup:

So, as I said before, you think you know better than a Treasury Department that trying to make their boss look good, but couldn't because the Repugnant Ones are spending more money than their earning and plan to earn less in future.



I think we should cut taxes a great deal more and spend a great deal less. I won't claim that I know more, but I acknowledge my position is not really in the mainstream of either major party, and I'm OK with that.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sat Jan 12, 2019 7:45 pm

Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:The federal government has plenty of revenue to accomplish its constitutionally mandated objectives. Let's do some serious cuts to the tax rate, not this chicken shit nibbling around the edges.

So you know better than a Treasury Department that was trying, if unsuccessfully, to make their boss look good



The economy is fine after the tax cuts. Imagine how great it would be with real ones. :thumbsup:

So, as I said before, you think you know better than a Treasury Department that trying to make their boss look good, but couldn't because the Repugnant Ones are spending more money than their earning and plan to earn less in future.



I think we should cut taxes a great deal more and spend a great deal less. I won't claim that I know more, but I acknowledge my position is not really in the mainstream of either major party, and I'm OK with that.

So, once again, you think you know better than a Treasury Department that trying to make their boss look good, but couldn't because the Repugnant Ones are spending more money than their earning and plan to earn less in future.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Maddog » Sat Jan 12, 2019 8:43 pm

I answered your question.

Do you have another?
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sat Jan 12, 2019 9:36 pm

Maddog wrote:I answered your question.

Do you have another?

You haven't answered it yet.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Maddog » Sun Jan 13, 2019 4:28 am

Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:I answered your question.

Do you have another?

You haven't answered it yet.

I think we should cut taxes a great deal more and spend a great deal less. I won't claim that I know more, but I acknowledge my position is not really in the mainstream of either major party, and I'm OK with that.
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Re: Tax cuts - the evidence is in.

Postby Cactus Jack » Sun Jan 13, 2019 9:33 am

Maddog wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:
Maddog wrote:I answered your question.

Do you have another?

You haven't answered it yet.

I think we should cut taxes a great deal more and spend a great deal less. I won't claim that I know more, but I acknowledge my position is not really in the mainstream of either major party, and I'm OK with that.

So you're just ducking the question. That's OK :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
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