Coup in Venezuela

Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:50 pm

Cactus Jack wrote:The inflation rate in Venezuela is 1.3 million % year on year
That means the hourly inflation rate is 1483% or, if you prefer, if you were paid £1,000 within the next hour it would be worth 67p - under those circumstances it doesn't matter who you call the president nobody is in charge


And yet Felch thinks people should simply stay quiet and not complain about their lot? And the fact that they do complain he blames on the yanks?

It seems we are blessed with our very own Manchurian Candidate having that idiot as a member.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby Fletch » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:54 pm

Cactus Jack wrote:The inflation rate in Venezuela is 1.3 million % year on year
That means the hourly inflation rate is 1483% or, if you prefer, if you were paid £1,000 within the next hour it would be worth 67p - under those circumstances it doesn't matter who you call the president nobody is in charge


Washington Will Impose Greater Sanctions On Venezuela Aug 21, 2017

Washington will impose greater sanctions on the embattled government of Venezuela. President Trump has already announced more names to Treasury's individual sanctions list, including Venezuelan president Nicolas Maduro. But more sanctions are right around the corner, especially if October elections look rigged.

In the war of words battle, Washington has been much more explosive of late.

On Aug. 14, vice president Mike Pence called Venezuela a "failed state" and that its downfall "threatened the security of the hemisphere and the people of the United States of America." Pence was doing what all VEEPs do in this case, reiterate what the Commander-in-Chief said just days prior. On Aug. 12, Trump played his usual strongman hand and said, "by the way, I'm not going to rule out a military option."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/ ... 9f70d86ac8

:shake head:
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Fri Jan 25, 2019 9:57 pm

Fletch wrote:
Cactus Jack wrote:The inflation rate in Venezuela is 1.3 million % year on year
That means the hourly inflation rate is 1483% or, if you prefer, if you were paid £1,000 within the next hour it would be worth 67p - under those circumstances it doesn't matter who you call the president nobody is in charge


Washington Will Impose Greater Sanctions On Venezuela Aug 21, 2017

Washington will impose greater sanctions on the embattled government of Venezuela. President Trump has already announced more names to Treasury's individual sanctions list, including Venezuelan president Nicolas Maduro. But more sanctions are right around the corner, especially if October elections look rigged.

In the war of words battle, Washington has been much more explosive of late.

On Aug. 14, vice president Mike Pence called Venezuela a "failed state" and that its downfall "threatened the security of the hemisphere and the people of the United States of America." Pence was doing what all VEEPs do in this case, reiterate what the Commander-in-Chief said just days prior. On Aug. 12, Trump played his usual strongman hand and said, "by the way, I'm not going to rule out a military option."

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kenrapoza/ ... 9f70d86ac8

:shake head:



Personally I think Brazil and Colombia ought to lead any and all interventions to stop this humanitarian crisis if El Presidente kills more people.

Murdering bastard
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 11:48 am

Venezuela: At least 20 dead, situation could ‘rapidly spiral out of control’ warns UN rights chief

Well over 350 people have also been detained in the recent protests, including 320 on 23 January alone, said the UN rights office, while staff have also reported raids on property in some of the poorest areas of Caracas where at least 180 protests have taken place this week.

We have received information from credible local sources that at least 20 people have died after allegedly being shot by security forces or by members of pro-government groups - OHCHR's Rupert Colville

He added: “The High Commissioner is extremely concerned, and I quote, ‘that the situation in Venezuela may rapidly spiral out of control with catastrophic consequences.’”

In her statement, Ms Bachelet insisted that it was vital to prevent a repetition of repression against protesters of the Government of President Nicolás Maduro, who was officially sworn back into office, just two weeks ago.

Grave rights abuses documented by OHCHR in 2017 included extrajudicial killings, widespread arbitrary detentions, restrictions to freedom of assembly and expression and indiscriminate house raids and attacks.

Mr Colville noted the High Commissioner’s appeal to the Venezuelan authorities to exercise restraint, especially the security forces.

They should also respect everyone’s fundamental right to peaceful assembly and freedom of expression, he continued, adding that the UN rights chief wished to remind them that the “excessive, disproportionate or indiscriminate use of force is clearly and unequivocally prohibited under international law”.

Exodus of 5,000 each day continues: UNHCR
At the Venezuelan border, meanwhile, UNHCR said that thousands of people continue to leave the country, amid the ongoing economic and security crisis. More than three million have done so in recent years.

“The population movement so far has remained constant since last year, and that is some 5,000 Venezuelans leaving their country every day on average,” Spokesperson Liz Throssell said.

She confirmed that UNHCR staff were also monitoring the situation at “key” border areas. “We are providing assistance to those in need, those who may be crossing the borders,” Ms Throssell explained. “With the mounting tension that we have seen between Venezuela and its neighbours, UNHCR has reinforced its presence along these borders; we are monitoring populations movement and we have been also preparing for any potential change in the number of refugees and migrants leaving Venezuela.”

Commenting on the situation of those travelling outside Venezuela to neighbouring countries, the UNHCR spokesperson noted that “we have seen a significant number in dire need of international refugee protection and humanitarian assistance.

https://news.un.org/en/story/2019/01/1031272


With a currency worth less than toilet paper, millions of Venezuelans voting with their feet by leaving the country due to power and fuel shortages,lack of food medicines etc it is abundantly clear that matters will only get worse - especially with house raids, civilians being shot for protesting about their lot and a repressive regime clearly prepared to crack down using force.
This is a humanitarian crisis of epic proportions already that can only get worse.
All of which is remarkable given the country's vast oil reserves
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby wutang » Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:41 pm

LordRaven wrote:Personally I think Brazil and Colombia ought to lead any and all interventions to stop this humanitarian crisis if El Presidente kills more people.

Murdering bastard



That the same Brazil whose fascist President openly talks about genocide against indigenous people?

If he is happy to do that to the indigenous people in his own country what do you think he would do to those in Venezuela :shake head:
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby wutang » Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:45 pm

Forgot to add that Columbia is another country where right wing paramilitary death squads love murdering indigenous people (as well as those with African heritage).

Definitely want them invading a country with a large indigenous/black population
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:50 pm

wutang wrote:
LordRaven wrote:Personally I think Brazil and Colombia ought to lead any and all interventions to stop this humanitarian crisis if El Presidente kills more people.

Murdering bastard



That the same Brazil whose fascist President openly talks about genocide against indigenous people?

If he is happy to do that to the indigenous people in his own country what do you think he would do to those in Venezuela :shake head:


Oh he's a twat alright but I am stating that it should be dealt with as a regional problem with the aid of the UN and not have world powers getting involved.
I would prefer the Venezuelan people deal with it internally but I fear that will just lead to Guaido "disappearing" and that will just cause civil war.
At which point Regional Troops (South Americans) wearing Blue Berets and working under a UN Mandate should be sent in on a Peace Keeping Mission to oversee Free and Fair Elections.
International Aid should be used to rebuild and all UN Agencies should stay put until peace is restored, a stable Government --who won't kill their own people - is in place and the economy is on the up.

As for Presidents who shoot their own people, I think they are cunts, but I hear no condemnation from you of Maduro?
Are you like Felch, happy that Assad and Maduro kill their own people? Or are you inclined to my way of thinking that they are all cunts who should not hold office.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:53 pm

wutang wrote:Forgot to add that Columbia is another country where right wing paramilitary death squads love murdering indigenous people (as well as those with African heritage).

Definitely want them invading a country with a large indigenous/black population


Having been to Columbia I never came across any of that?

My point is, just like Africa, make such matters a regional matter and give the neighbouring countries a measure of responsibility to via UN Mandates to go in and help maintain the peace and restore Venezuela to sanity for the sake of its peoples.

They should be keen to get involved as a humanitarian crisis is about to affect all of them.

You seem to be suggesting doing nothing, and that is far worse imo
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 12:54 pm

wutang wrote:Forgot to add that Columbia is another country where right wing paramilitary death squads love murdering indigenous people (as well as those with African heritage).

Definitely want them invading a country with a large indigenous/black population


p.s. UN Mandated Troops do not INVADE, they go in with an agreed mandate between UN and the Country involved.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby wutang » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:04 pm

LordRaven wrote:.

As for Presidents who shoot their own people, I think they are cunts, but I hear no condemnation from you of Maduro?


I oppose Maduro and the opposition party.

I support those who want to see the back of both of them.

The thing you have to remember about Venezula is that it is historically a country with an insanely rich white ruling class with an extremely poor black/indigenous population (similar to other South American countries). Chavez for all his faults was popular because he promised to address this - the right wingers (i.e rich white dudes) hated him for this.

Despite his flaws, and there were many, he remained fairly popular simply because black and indigenous people remember how bad it was for them under the rule of the rich white dudes.

The politics is the same in Brazil and Columbia - hence paramilitary right wing death squads murder black and indigenous peoples all the time especially when they try to rise up and address the massive inequality and poverty they have to endure.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby wutang » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:06 pm

LordRaven wrote:
p.s. UN Mandated Troops do not INVADE, they go in with an agreed mandate between UN and the Country involved.


The UN troops have a history of standing back and letting death squads commit genocide... expecting them to intervene while the right wing paramilitaries go murder crazy is ludicrous
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:10 pm

wutang wrote:
LordRaven wrote:.

As for Presidents who shoot their own people, I think they are cunts, but I hear no condemnation from you of Maduro?


I oppose Maduro and the opposition party.

I support those who want to see the back of both of them.

The thing you have to remember about Venezula is that it is historically a country with an insanely rich white ruling class with an extremely poor black/indigenous population (similar to other South American countries). Chavez for all his faults was popular because he promised to address this - the right wingers (i.e rich white dudes) hated him for this.

Despite his flaws, and there were many, he remained fairly popular simply because black and indigenous people remember how bad it was for them under the rule of the rich white dudes.

The politics is the same in Brazil and Columbia - hence paramilitary right wing death squads murder black and indigenous peoples all the time especially when they try to rise up and address the massive inequality and poverty they have to endure.


You oppose the opposition in Venezuela? Watching the news reports it would seem to me that they are mainly the coloured people you speak of who are, and have been traditionally, hard done by and prone to beatings, house searches and arrest --or being shot.
I don't understand why you are against the very people you feel are getting a raw deal.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby wutang » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:18 pm

LordRaven wrote:You oppose the opposition in Venezuela? Watching the news reports it would seem to me that they are mainly the coloured people you speak of who are, and have been traditionally, hard done by and prone to beatings, house searches and arrest --or being shot.
I don't understand why you are against the very people you feel are getting a raw deal.


There are different groups of opposition. The opposition party trying to take power is only one group and there are mass protest involving people who hate them as much as they hate the ruling party

Opposition to Maduro (and Chavez before him) can come from the left as much as from the right.

Dumping them all into one group does nothing but create a misleading impression of the situation
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:26 pm

wutang wrote:
LordRaven wrote:
p.s. UN Mandated Troops do not INVADE, they go in with an agreed mandate between UN and the Country involved.


The UN troops have a history of standing back and letting death squads commit genocide... expecting them to intervene while the right wing paramilitaries go murder crazy is ludicrous


You are talking of Srebinica I believe, that was a terrible mistake by one UN Commander who was more concerned by the safety of his own troops and in doing so allowed Ratko Mladic Scorpions in to perpetrate a genocide -- a stain on the UN for sure.

However as you well know the break up of Yugoslavia brought old wounds and deep seated hatreds to the surface and there were a number of internal wars that broke out and Genocide and Rape were the order of the day until the UN got involved.

And within a comparatively short period of time, and in spite of the ethnic tensions and total hatred of each other, the UN involvement had all sides at the table and a lasting peace was brokered.

I would call that a major success ---especially considering the Nazis never managed to fully subjugate the peoples of Yugoslavia.

That is a remarkable result and to have done nothing --as you seem to suggest re Venezuela --would have just made matters worse.
Last edited by LordRaven on Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Coup in Venezuela

Postby LordRaven » Sat Jan 26, 2019 1:29 pm

wutang wrote:
LordRaven wrote:You oppose the opposition in Venezuela? Watching the news reports it would seem to me that they are mainly the coloured people you speak of who are, and have been traditionally, hard done by and prone to beatings, house searches and arrest --or being shot.
I don't understand why you are against the very people you feel are getting a raw deal.


There are different groups of opposition. The opposition party trying to take power is only one group and there are mass protest involving people who hate them as much as they hate the ruling party

Opposition to Maduro (and Chavez before him) can come from the left as much as from the right.

Dumping them all into one group does nothing but create a misleading impression of the situation


See my last re Different Groups in the former Yugoslavia. I disagree, the UN can have a huge effect to stabilise the country, make people feel safe, provide much needed aid food and medecines and brokers a peace.
It worked in the Balkans and it would work in Venezuela - but only with regional troops who have a vested interest for the sake of their own countries
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