The NHS is no more.

A right load of bollocks...

Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Random » Sat Jan 23, 2016 9:28 pm

The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby rollup » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:18 pm

ambient wrote:Thank you for your erudite and well argued response

Go fuck yourself .... after you've maybe checked out some facts for yourself.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby ambient » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:33 pm

Another well argued and reasoned comment, well done
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby McAz » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:37 pm

Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.

What's your proposed alternative for these poor old people with no-one to care for them?
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby rollup » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:48 pm

The nhs is fucking huge!
Therefore it needs constant tweeking ... steering directing.

NHS among developed world's most efficient health systems, says study
http://www.theguardian.com/society/2011/aug/07/nhs-among-most-efficient-health-services

This is why the Tory boys have said it's a gold mine just waiting for them to mine it.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby rollup » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:56 pm

.......
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Random » Sat Jan 23, 2016 10:58 pm

Aziz wrote:
Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.

What's your proposed alternative for these poor old people with no-one to care for them?

More help in the community carers with an increase in their wage to entice them to the job.

person gets to stay in their own home and have some independence and dignity, saves money on hospital beds.

Even if all that was exclusively funded by the state it would cost less than hospital care.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby McAz » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:11 pm

Random wrote:
Aziz wrote:
Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.

What's your proposed alternative for these poor old people with no-one to care for them?

More help in the community carers with an increase in their wage to entice them to the job.

person gets to stay in their own home and have some independence and dignity, saves money on hospital beds.

Even if all that was exclusively funded by the state it would cost less than hospital care.


Sounds good. :thumbsup:

And perhaps greater financial help for the hospice movement too.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Random » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:15 pm

My own council has just built a small village of bungalows that is going to have a warden. I think that is a good idea.

They're small but have little gardens and all that is all that is needed. Much better than being on a hospital ward, and having someone to hand if needed.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby McAz » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:27 pm

Random wrote:My own council has just built a small village of bungalows that is going to have a warden. I think that is a good idea.

They're small but have little gardens and all that is all that is needed. Much better than being on a hospital ward, and having someone to hand if needed.


I agree entirely.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Guest » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:34 pm

Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.


Because Tories slashed the social care fund. The support systems are all but extinct now, causing problems for Hospitals.

Nothing to do with the NHS, everything to do with Tory zero state ideology.

Look at their other great success, old people's care homes. Expensive, non caring and even downright dangerous. Poor standards, low paid staff, cheap food and numerous scandals in the papers. One woman recently died having been covered in rat bites if I remember correctly. But Tory donors/voters increase their wealth and the government can blame care homes instead of themselves. Absolved from all responsibility. Job done as far as they're concerned. :shake head:
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Random » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:41 pm

Aziz wrote:
Random wrote:My own council has just built a small village of bungalows that is going to have a warden. I think that is a good idea.

They're small but have little gardens and all that is all that is needed. Much better than being on a hospital ward, and having someone to hand if needed.


I agree entirely.

I agree with your more hospice funding too. End of days should be spent in a homely peaceful setting, not a clinical one.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby rollup » Sat Jan 23, 2016 11:57 pm

Childrens hospices get nothing.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Random » Sun Jan 24, 2016 12:35 am

Guest wrote:
Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.


Because Tories slashed the social care fund. The support systems are all but extinct now, causing problems for Hospitals.

Nothing to do with the NHS, everything to do with Tory zero state ideology.

Look at their other great success, old people's care homes. Expensive, non caring and even downright dangerous. Poor standards, low paid staff, cheap food and numerous scandals in the papers. One woman recently died having been covered in rat bites if I remember correctly. But Tory donors/voters increase their wealth and the government can blame care homes instead of themselves. Absolved from all responsibility. Job done as far as they're concerned. :shake head:

Cut backs are good. It makes them look at where they can save money, and how the NHS got to be used as something it shouldn't.

I doubt the land in my area would have had bungalows built there now if it had not been for one public service putting pressure on another because it can't cope. It could have been flats or 4 bed houses to house the immigrants!

The newspapers never report the good stories from the care homes but in a very expensive one you'll get more carers to resident ratio than a public.
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Re: The NHS is no more.

Postby Guest » Sun Jan 24, 2016 12:57 am

Random wrote:
Guest wrote:
Random wrote:The NHS is like a giant care home now Jack. It wasn't built for that. It isn't cost effective for someone to stay in hospital because there is nowhere else to go and someone to care for them at home,and it isn't a nice way to spend your last days.


Because Tories slashed the social care fund. The support systems are all but extinct now, causing problems for Hospitals.

Nothing to do with the NHS, everything to do with Tory zero state ideology.

Look at their other great success, old people's care homes. Expensive, non caring and even downright dangerous. Poor standards, low paid staff, cheap food and numerous scandals in the papers. One woman recently died having been covered in rat bites if I remember correctly. But Tory donors/voters increase their wealth and the government can blame care homes instead of themselves. Absolved from all responsibility. Job done as far as they're concerned. :shake head:

Cut backs are good. It makes them look at where they can save money, and how the NHS got to be used as something it shouldn't.

I doubt the land in my area would have had bungalows built there now if it had not been for one public service putting pressure on another because it can't cope. It could have been flats or 4 bed houses to house the immigrants!

The newspapers never report the good stories from the care homes but in a very expensive one you'll get more carers to resident ratio than a public.


Until they hit you or your close ones

No idea about the bungalows but property developers only ever do what is most profitable to them. They are not a social benefit like council houses were, or are where they still exist. Slowly being phased out and rents converted from the truly affordable council rent in to the ludicrously named 'affordable rents' which are anything but.

Thatcher was criticised for saying 'there's no such thing as society' yet this government has done more to make that true than she ever did.

Zero state ideology benefits only the wealthy.
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