Choose Your News To Fit Your Agenda - It's The new Black

[Trapper John]

Looks like my thread was taken up by the national media after all and the whole world by the sounds of some posters here.

Still better late than never I suppose. Maybe the delay was because they didn't know he was from Eire, they probably thought he was English so not worth banging on about.

I mean this was early Tuesday evening when those swarthy racist Italian thugs attacked the poor white pastey guy just enjoying a quiet drink before going off to watch his favourite team, not today, not even yesterday, it was Tuesday evening, still I suppose they had to wait for other stories to dry up before slipping it in.

All over social media eh? - football social media yes - not the sort of social media which springs into action when there is a sniff of a minority involvement.

So the charges have been downgraded from attempted murder to GBH and just for the one guy eh? sounds like good old British justice to me. I didn't know the Italian community was so big in the UK, that we needed to protect it for the sake of community relations.

In Italy of course they'd already be buried in some 13th century pit they used to put inquisition prisoners in where you have to pipe sunshine to them and thats before the court case, if they ever got one.

[Trapper John]

This has been all over Twitter especially. I feel for the guy injured obviously, but what hasn’t been so widely discussed is that the police, who might have helped this guy were busy dealing with Liverpool fans, who had destroyed numerous police vehicles and had occupied their time.

As usual the Liverpool fans are the poor victims...

What was the source of that - the same one that said Liverpool fans were pissing on dead fans at Hillsborough?

They were probably busy though, searching other Roma fans who had turned up with knives and other offensive weapons.

[Goodwife]

This has been all over Twitter especially. I feel for the guy injured obviously, but what hasn’t been so widely discussed is that the police, who might have helped this guy were busy dealing with Liverpool fans, who had destroyed numerous police vehicles and had occupied their time.

As usual the Liverpool fans are the poor victims...

What was the source of that - the same one that said Liverpool fans were pissing on dead fans at Hillsborough?

They were probably busy though, searching other Roma fans who had turned up with knives and other offensive weapons.

I was at Old Trafford the night we beat Roma 7-1, there had been trouble in Italy when we played them in the first leg. It was the most heavily policed game I have ever been too. There was a lot of police presence in picadilly gardens then from the tram at trafford all the way to the stadium there was a lot of coppers and police horses. Round the stadium was packed tight with police and it was a pat down and root through your bag before being allowed into the stadium.

It was quite scary!

Roma Ultra's have form for fighting and causing trouble so I am surprised this isn't getting more news. Downgrading the charges is disgraceful!

[Trapper John]

What happened to this guy was terrible and the perpetrators should be severely punished and receive prison sentences.

But what evidence is there to suggest that it is a racially motivated attack rather than bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team?

The incident involving the Chelsea fans involved a commuter on his way home rather than another team's supporter and the Chelsea fans were clearly shouting "We're racist, we're racist and that's the way we like it."

You're comparing apples with oranges.

It's almost as if you have an agenda.

Firstly, there is no such thing as "bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team?" what you think we have special laws for football fans when it comes to violence? - attempted murder is attempted murder whether you are waiting to see a football match or not. Jeez you types do like to stick a tag on something don't you - what if it doesn't have a tag, it never happened?

As for evidence, maybe we'll get some evidence if they bother to try and find a common or garden Liverpuddlian who can speak Italian, shouldn't be hard the Paris Metro is full of Frenchies who can understand English football chants. In my experience people rarely go on a murdering rampage in complete silence.

You must let me know where you get those monochrome spectacles which only sees a certain type of racism.

Don't you know we live in age now where any attack against someone who is different from you is automatically classed as a hate crime, as this bloke was clearly set upon by others who were 'different' from him, in this case Italians, people from another country and culture - it is clearly a racially motivated attack, we've had 80,000 + alleged hate crimes investigated since Brexit which set that precedence.

[Dean]

This has been all over Twitter especially. I feel for the guy injured obviously, but what hasn’t been so widely discussed is that the police, who might have helped this guy were busy dealing with Liverpool fans, who had destroyed numerous police vehicles and had occupied their time.

As usual the Liverpool fans are the poor victims...

What was the source of that - the same one that said Liverpool fans were pissing on dead fans at Hillsborough?

They were probably busy though, searching other Roma fans who had turned up with knives and other offensive weapons.

The source was numerous pictures of Liverpool fans doing it. The pics are out there if you’re really interested. I get the feeling you just want to spin a racial story that isn’t there...

[Trapper John]

This has been all over Twitter especially. I feel for the guy injured obviously, but what hasn’t been so widely discussed is that the police, who might have helped this guy were busy dealing with Liverpool fans, who had destroyed numerous police vehicles and had occupied their time.

As usual the Liverpool fans are the poor victims...

What was the source of that - the same one that said Liverpool fans were pissing on dead fans at Hillsborough?

They were probably busy though, searching other Roma fans who had turned up with knives and other offensive weapons.

The source was numerous pictures of Liverpool fans doing it. The pics are out there if you’re really interested. I get the feeling you just want to spin a racial story that isn’t there...

Of course, thats why I called the thread what I did. Take an event and spin it how you like, everyone's doing it - it really is the 'new black'

Get enough people with the same agenda as you to back you up and suddenly everyone agrees and it becomes the truth, in the old days they called it propaganda.

Thats why I posted this paragraph at the end of my post to Avon, this is why we are where we are now:

Don't you know we live in age now where any attack against someone who is different from you is automatically classed as a hate crime, as this bloke was clearly set upon by others who were 'different' from him, in this case Italians, people from another country and culture - it is clearly a racially motivated attack, we've had 80,000 + alleged hate crimes investigated since Brexit which set that precedence.

[Avon Barksdale]

What happened to this guy was terrible and the perpetrators should be severely punished and receive prison sentences.

But what evidence is there to suggest that it is a racially motivated attack rather than bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team?

The incident involving the Chelsea fans involved a commuter on his way home rather than another team's supporter and the Chelsea fans were clearly shouting "We're racist, we're racist and that's the way we like it."

You're comparing apples with oranges.

It's almost as if you have an agenda.

Firstly, there is no such thing as "bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team?" what you think we have special laws for football fans when it comes to violence? - attempted murder is attempted murder whether you are waiting to see a football match or not. Jeez you types do like to stick a tag on something don't you - what if it doesn't have a tag, it never happened?

As for evidence, maybe we'll get some evidence if they bother to try and find a common or garden Liverpuddlian who can speak Italian, shouldn't be hard the Paris Metro is full of Frenchies who can understand English football chants. In my experience people rarely go on a murdering rampage in complete silence.

You must let me know where you get those monochrome spectacles which only sees a certain type of racism.

Don't you know we live in age now where any attack against someone who is different from you is automatically classed as a hate crime, as this bloke was clearly set upon by others who were 'different' from him, in this case Italians, people from another country and culture - it is clearly a racially motivated attack, we've had 80,000 + alleged hate crimes investigated since Brexit which set that precedence.

That's a long winded way of admitting you have no evidence to back up your spurious racial claim.

As to your point about hooliganism I'm surprised you dismiss it so readily. It's essentially in-group motivated gang violence and criminality which you have no seeming problem discussing with a broad brush approach when it comes to say, knife crime and the black community but only now you want a nuanced understanding? Player please. If I have monochromatic specs they clearly have a "TJ" engraving.

As to your last point I agree in many ways which you would know if you had been paying attention. I think hate crime laws can be counterproductive and hurt BME people more than they help us. It allows a narrative of general white persecution and victimhood to be peddled which distracts political resources away from class issues and lets people in power off the hook.

[Trapper John]

The latest news on Sean Cox is that he is stable but still critical. Doctors are saying they will try to take him out of the induced coma he was placed in after suffering horrendous brain injuries, my thoughts are with his family who are at his bedside, praying as we all do that he will survive and return to normality some day soon.

As some have tried to downplay this incident as "bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team" the truth as always isn't as apparent as it appears to be - not that this sort of crime would be acceptable in football as it wouldn't in any other sphere of society.

Mr Cox (pictured below) is a 53 year old father of three from the republic of Ireland, a member and great supporter of a gaelic football club. Described as mild mannered and someone who helped everyone and anyone, he had travelled to Liverpool to watch the game and was enjoying a quiet pint with his brother when they were set upon by Italian thugs in their 20's which left Mr Cox in his present condition.

Even with the most partisan of views, you could hardly say Mr Cox looks like a stereotypical 'football hooligan' ripe for targetting by these vicious foreign animals, so what could have been the reason for this unprovoked attack on a man approaching his 60th decade, if not for the fact that he was just different from them?

[Jem]

I saw it as football related, not race related.

[Avon Barksdale]

As some have tried to downplay this incident as "bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team" the truth as always isn't as apparent as it appears to be - not that this sort of crime would be acceptable in football as it wouldn't in any other sphere of society.

Please do not misrepresent my position in such a heinous fashion.

I never stated Mr Cox was a hooligan but rather he was targeted by hooligans rather than racists. In other words he was an innocent football fan who got beaten up by these thugs for the crime of supporting a different team and that was the motivation.

It's a shame that a small band of self entitled criminals can unfairly taint a whole community with their actions and that undeserved reputation sticks for decades making it harder for them to obtain justice due to negative public perception when it comes to other issues. I wonder where else that happens?

[Trapper John]

The police were busy that night, whether they would have been able to help Mr Cox in his situation is debateable but they did have their hands full dealing with, as varified reports from the Daily Mirror show in the links below, headed:

'Football fan thrown to ground as Liverpool police clash with Roma supporters' ahead of Champions League match'

'Liverpool fan lies motionless on ground and man seen clutching hammer after 'Roma ultras use belts in attacks on home supporters'

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... s-12432605

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12420558

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12421326

I haven't been able to find any reports from varified sources - not just uploads to twitter and facebook from people who might have reason to suggest otherwise - that Liverpool fans and police clashed, that police cars were turned over by Liverpool fans or that Liverpool fans were doing anything other defending themselves from these vicious Italian thugs, or that the police were doing anything other than trying to uphold law and order and defending themselves from these same thugs.

[Guest]

The police were busy that night, whether they would have been able to help Mr Cox in his situation is debateable but they did have their hands full dealing with, as varified reports from the Daily Mirror show in the links below, headed:

'Football fan thrown to ground as Liverpool police clash with Roma supporters' ahead of Champions League match'

'Liverpool fan lies motionless on ground and man seen clutching hammer after 'Roma ultras use belts in attacks on home supporters'

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... s-12432605

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12420558

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12421326

I haven't been able to find any reports from varified sources - not just uploads to twitter and facebook from people who might have reason to suggest otherwise - that Liverpool fans and police clashed, that police cars were turned over by Liverpool fans or that Liverpool fans were doing anything other defending themselves from these vicious Italian thugs, or that the police were doing anything other than trying to uphold law and order and defending themselves from these same thugs.

try a freedom of information request to liverpool police.

[Trapper John]

As some have tried to downplay this incident as "bog standard hooliganism against a fan of an opposing team" the truth as always isn't as apparent as it appears to be - not that this sort of crime would be acceptable in football as it wouldn't in any other sphere of society.

Please do not misrepresent my position in such a heinous fashion.

I never stated Mr Cox was a hooligan but rather he was targeted by hooligans rather than racists. In other words he was an innocent football fan who got beaten up by these thugs for the crime of supporting a different team and that was the motivation.

It's a shame that a small band of self entitled criminals can unfairly taint a whole community with their actions and that undeserved reputation sticks for decades making it harder for them to obtain justice due to negative public perception when it comes to other issues. I wonder where else that happens?

Yes I wonder. My brother was at the Arsenal game a few years ago when Napoli fans ran riot, smashing eating and drinking establishments around the ground as they went, attacking customers and chanting amongst other things, 'death to the English pigs' that wasn't classed as a racially motivated attack either.

Of course it was easier to tag it with the most obvious reason for it and call it a day. Good god! our lovely european partners and friends saying that about us? - we can't have that now can we.

[Trapper John]

The police were busy that night, whether they would have been able to help Mr Cox in his situation is debateable but they did have their hands full dealing with, as varified reports from the Daily Mirror show in the links below, headed:

'Football fan thrown to ground as Liverpool police clash with Roma supporters' ahead of Champions League match'

'Liverpool fan lies motionless on ground and man seen clutching hammer after 'Roma ultras use belts in attacks on home supporters'

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... s-12432605

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12420558

https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football ... d-12421326

I haven't been able to find any reports from varified sources - not just uploads to twitter and facebook from people who might have reason to suggest otherwise - that Liverpool fans and police clashed, that police cars were turned over by Liverpool fans or that Liverpool fans were doing anything other defending themselves from these vicious Italian thugs, or that the police were doing anything other than trying to uphold law and order and defending themselves from these same thugs.

try a freedom of information request to liverpool police.

Why?

[Trapper John]

I saw it as football related, not race related.

Why because it happened before a football match? - Sean Cox could easily have been just a local drinking in a pub with no interest in football whatsoever, do you think the Italian thugs would have asked for his credentials before beating him across the head with a hammer or iron bar?